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Discussion Starter #1
What is the difference in thread sizes, which is preferable for a newbie wrapping his first rod. Thanks.
 

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i started with A,but at the time had no idea ther were different sizes.i use A for all decorative wrapping and under wraps, D for guide binding on offshore and heaver rods,doubled up A for guides on smaller saltwater rods and single A for guides on freshwater rods. there are alot of differences in manufactures threads also,gudebrod A is a bit thicker than fishhawk A for example,not a very noticable difference,but a difference,so keep that in mind also.once you chose a brand,try to stay with it for a couple builds till you've figured out the qualities that you're looking for or not,also make sure to use color preseverer on maderia or sulky rayons,they have a coating on them that reacts unfavorably with epoxyies.happy wrapping
 

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Sewing machine thread and metallics are treated with silicon oil that repels epoxy. It would be best to stay away from this type of thread/metallic until you gain a little more experience. I recommend using thread and metallic that does not require color preserver. Each manufacturer has a name for this type of thread. It is generally refered to as NCP. NCP is a trademark of Gudebrod, hence the various names. (NCP, Colorfast, Trucolor, Opaque, and others.)
 

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actually don,for a newbie i would recommend using CP on any wrap,helps narrow the learning curve by acting as a light adhesive,eliminating the dreaded pattern crawl.i use CP on all thread,NCP or otherwise,to get more consistent colors throughout the pattern and smaller tie offs also,just my .02
 

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actually don,for a newbie i would recommend using CP on any wrap,helps narrow the learning curve by acting as a light adhesive,eliminating the dreaded pattern crawl.i use CP on all thread,NCP or otherwise,to get more consistent colors throughout the pattern and smaller tie offs also,just my .02
To add to this a little, dont ever ever ever use black NCP it is rarely black after finish is applied it usually turns grey or even a blue color. Finding the right CP can be a real PIA honestly some dont really offer very good color retentions once applied, severely darkening the colors after its applied and dried. Some if applied to think leave a milky look to the wrap when finish is applied. IF your doing a wrap that requires packing dont mix a and d sized threads it will be a packing nightmare. The single most important piece of advice anyone can offer is to TEST, TEST, TEST get a piece of pvc pipe and test cp's epoxies etc...
 

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"for a newbie wrapping his first rod."

Keep it simple as possible until experience is gained.

Size A thread for under wraps (if used).
Size D for overwraps.

NCP blocks bleed through of the blanks color through thread (such as nylon). Bleed through is a greater problem with lighter colored thread.

As Tacpayne mentions, color preserver has adverse effects when used on black thread. Black nylon thread does not require color preserver to prevent bleed through. A popular combination is black nylon thread with gold trim. No color preserver is required.

As a first rod, time may be better spent on learning guide and reel seat placement, guide alignment, guide sizes and types.
Some sources of information are the library of rodbuilding.org and numerous youtube videos.

Regarding testing, here's the source of tubes that I use. Pultruded fiberglass is lowest priced that I have found.
http://goodwinds.com/fiberglass/pultruded-fiberglass-tubing.html
 

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unfortunatly i find technique and packing cause more detrimental bleed thru than thread type,not saying there is not a difference,as there are plenty of examples comparing the 2 ,i just find that a well packed and burnished wrap will show negligible differences
 

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On his first rod, phillyguy should not have to be concerned with patterns or butt wraps.

Initially, the concern will probably be guide wraps that are put on with the correct tension and are packed tightly. If this is done correctly, there should be little need to burnish the thread. Poorly done wrapping will result in spaces between the wraps and have the lower layer show through.

This is entirely different from bleed through. Bleed through occurs when the nylon thread becomes tanslucent due to the application of epoxy. This effect can be used with great results. At an ICAST event several years ago, I saw a bamboo fly rod that used an amber colored silk to hold the guides. The guides looked like they were simply sitting on the bamboo. The amber colored silk (when translucent) tinted the guide feet to match the bamboo. As an experiment, I made my last rod with a metallic copper under wrap and an orange nylon over wrap. The result was that, in the bright light the wraps looked orange. However in the shade, the wraps started to look more candy apple.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Wow, that's a lot of info. As DonB said, I'm looking to keep it simple simple simple. At this point I don't enough to ask an intelligent question, but when the kit arrives I'm sure I will. Now I just have to build my wrapper.
 

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Hey phillyguy,

I would recommend that you start out exactly as you are doing. Something simple and inexpensive (a kit) and develop resources for your specific needs. This forum, books or DVDs, and publications by manufactures (this could be youtube videoes or published instructions) should help in developing your knowledge base.

Best wishes on your new career!
 

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Phillyguy, I'm not as experienced as most of these guys, but I have wrapped enough rods to learn from my mistakes. I live in Mayfair, so if you want to borrow a book, or need any help just let me know.
 

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You would be amazed at what an afternoon of having someone help you will do for your learning curve. There are many sources for information, tapping into someone's knowledge in person is priceless. Good luck phillyguy, there will always be someone here to answer any question you have.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Phillyguy, I'm not as experienced as most of these guys, but I have wrapped enough rods to learn from my mistakes. I live in Mayfair, so if you want to borrow a book, or need any help just let me know.
Thanks Lick, I just finished building my wrapper ( I think it came out nice) and I'm sure the questions will come thick and fast when my kit arrives. I bought an American Tackle kit from mudhole.com. For $136 I can't go too far wrong I guess. I'll buy you a beer at Smokeaters sometime and we can talk shop.
 

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son, these folks are giving you a lot of good info, but keep it simple, first rod one blank one set of guides one handle one color thread. Dark thread regular or ncp. Your origional question was about thread size. For inshore or freshwater use size C. For surf or a boat rod use D. Single wraps one or two coats of finish. Mud Hole has a dvd called rodbuilding 101. You can order it on line or give them a call. I am new to this site but I have been building rods since 1982. E-mail me or send a pm if I can help E.P.
 

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Thanks Lick, I just finished building my wrapper ( I think it came out nice) and I'm sure the questions will come thick and fast when my kit arrives. I bought an American Tackle kit from mudhole.com. For $136 I can't go too far wrong I guess. I'll buy you a beer at Smokeaters sometime and we can talk shop.
Sounds good to me.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Ok, time to think about guide layout. The kit included 7 guides plus tip. Seems like one too many for a 10' spinner, yes? Also, the largest guide in the kit is a 30, does that seem reasonable for a standard COF setup or should I get a 40? Thanks.
 
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